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Can someone with a bit of time please try to decipher something for me from the WW1 army records? I'm stuck on one - or, possibly, two words.

The soldier is William John Osborne, number 1239, born in 1866 in Cheshunt, Hertfordshire. Cheshunt appears as Che? on the list of records.

The page I'm looking at is page 7, entitled Inside Sheet. It reads: Stating man is ??????? on a charge of "Incest"........

It could be one long word or two shorter ones and the first part could read "under".

I've been looking at this for weeks now so would be glad of any help.

Annie

'under remand'

Dea x

The first bit could be 'under perusal'

Thanks, both. I can see both of those now! Seems our William was a naughty boy.


Annie

Either way, he was under suspicion!

It was definitely 'under remand' i.e. 'detained' by the Police.

He was sentenced to 7 months - do you have the details already?

Dea x

Have you seen his records on Find My Past? They give more details of his service, including dates of engagement, transfer to reserves and recall to Service for Boer War duties. Also where and when he was posted. He was in Bermuda, Halifax Nova Scotia, Barbados and South Africa where he was awarded Queens south Africa Medal with clasps for Cape Colony and Orange Free State. Records his NOK as Father Isaac of ? High Hill Ferry Clapton. Some of the pages are duplicates of what is on Ancestry, but much easier to read.

There is nothing there re his accident or the remand incident.

EDIT - I tell a lie, but those pages plus some of the very hard to read attestation pages are mixed in with a Wm John OsboUrne aged 22 when he enlisted into the Royal West Kents in 1915!!

There is also a copy of his 1945 death certificate with some notes on the reverse - presume as his entitlement to pension would end.

If you don't have access I can (hopefully) download and send.

Thank you so much, everyone. I haven't looked on findmypast - should have thought of that and I'd no idea he got seven months! There is a daughter, Edith, listed who was born in Nova Scotia in 1891 and she came to Shropshire in the same year. She's not William's wife's daughter so could be the result of the incest charge. I'm still looking for an immigration record. She must have been only a couple of months old when she travelled. On the 1891 England census she is living with grandparents.

Thanks again, everyone. Wish I'd asked sooner now!

Annie

Dea, where do I find the seven months info please and greyghost, the death details? Sorry to be a pain.

Annie

Sorry, just found the death cert.

On the 1911 census Edith is 20 and listed as William's daughter. William is listed as married but no wife with him.

Yes, Margee, William's wife, Fanny, was in an asylum in Shropshire then and had been there since the early 1900s. She spent the rest of her life in different asylums until she died in her eighties in one in Bishop's Stortford. No-one knows why she was put in there in the first place.

Annie

On FMP:

Lichfield Mercury 21 February 1913
Staffordshire Winter Assizes:

Heard in Camera.

William John Osborne (44), gardener, who was committed at Eccleshaw
was sentenced to seven months for an assault on his daughter.

Dea x

Thanks, Dea. Maybe the daughter was Edith.

Annie

I DO hope so as the other daughters were awfully young !!!

Dea x

Nudge

The DC is on FMP (may be on Ancestry??)
FMP transcription
WILLIAM JOHN
Last name OSBORNE
Birth year 1867
Birth parish CHESHUNT
Birth town CHESHUNT
Birth county HERTFORDSHIRE
Birth country ENGLAND
Service number 1239
Rank -
Regiment Duke of Wellington's (West Riding Regiment) - 33rd & 76th Foot
Document Type Attestation
Attestation year 1885
Attestation Day 11
Attestation Month 3
Attestation age years 18
Attestation age months 11
Attestation Corps Duke of Wellington's (West Riding Regiment)
Attestation service number 1239
Discharge Corps Duke of Wellington's (West Riding Regiment)
Series WO97 chelsea pensioners british army service records 1760-1913
Box 5630
Box Record Number 51
Record set British Army Service Records 1760-1915

The DC is about image 8

Will send by PM

Det - if in time - Annie said she'd found the DC see post 20 Jan @ 1735. Reads as though she has access to FMP.

Didn't spot that. Oh well - better 2 copies than none ;-)

Yes, thanks very much. I hadn't thought to look on findmypast until someone gave me a nudge.

Annie