Find Ancestors

Elsie Hall gave birth to a boy December 1934. At the time she was resident at Oakhill Home, Cheetham Hill, Manchester.

The reason for my post is because I would like to find information about Elsie's stay at the home. Did the home have records and who would I need to contact as the home no longer exists? I have already tried the Salvation Army, who replied to my email saying they only bring living relatives together.

Elsie died in Canada. She married James Mitchell Nelson in 1933. I would appreciate some ideas of who I should contact who might hold this information.
Thank you in advance

Your previous thread about this:

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/records_office/thread/1008960

No help, but interesting, maybe!

http://tinyurl.com/gtckmlr

Re men's socks.

Some other queries about Oakhill, with answers all seeming to agree that if the Salvation Army can't help, then nobody can.

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=485728.0

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=173307.0
(That one possibly posted by you?)

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=586913.0

SALVATION ARMY. - Commissioner Adelaide Cox, writing for the Women Social Workers, pleads for some Christmas cheer for their 2,000 sorrowful and desolate protégés: for the aged, afflicted poor, many of whom, she says, live in one room with no fire and little food: and for the neglected little ones, “poorly clad and often ill-used, who live in Slumland and are looking for Father Christmas.” Money, garments, toys, coal, or food will be most gladly received, and should be addressed to the Officer in Charge of the Oakhill Home, Cheetham Hill, or of either of the Slum Posts - 29, Alexandra Place, Rochdale Road, and 144, Greengate, Salford.

http://tinyurl.com/hadk3z2

http://www.childrenshomes.org.uk/list/MH4.shtml


This maybe helpful, below??


For most of our former maternity homes (including Oakhill/Oak Hill) we do not hold any original records, and most of what we know about the women and girls who used these homes comes from a series of ledgers known as The Girls’ Statement Books. In effect these were records of discharge, and they were held centrally at our Women’s’ Social Work headquarters in Mare Street, Hackney.
Because these books have survived we have two series (London and Country) running from 1886 for more than a century. Unfortunately there is one major gap in the Country series, from March 1942 to March 1948 inclusive. This means that we have no statement book entries for discharges between these dates. Since these books record discharges and not births it does mean that births that took place a few months before this period may not be recorded, while conversely that births that took place in late 1947 or early 1948 may be.

http://tinyurl.com/hnldfdd

Thank you for the information. I have a few leads to follow so hopefully will find something more. This time I've made a note and will make some enquiries. I'd forgotten I'd already asked about this home back in 2008. Kids are older now so I have more time on my hands.

Thanks again

Could you have your dates mixed up ?

You say you are looking for a boy born Dec 1934 but mother married in 1933.

If she wed in 1933 then surely the 1934 boy would be her husbands child and
have his name ! ?

The marriage

So why isn't the boy registered as Nelson??

Marriages Jun 1933
Hall Elsie Nelson Castle W. 10b 710
Nelson James M Hall Castle W. 10b 710


Is this her husband ?

JAMES MITCHELL
Last name NELSON
Birth year 1909
Birth quarter 2
Registration month -
Mother's last name -
District CASTLE WARD
County Northumberland
Country England
Volume 10B
Page 408
Record set England & Wales births 1837-2006

!???

1939 register

37 Palatine Road , Manchester C.B., Lancashire, England
Start free family tree View original imagePrint
FIRST NAME(S) LAST NAME(S) DOB OCCUPATION
Elsie Nelson 06 Sep 1908 Assistant Nurse widow



7 more people who are officially closed
Jane Hanson 01 Nov 1896 Housekeeper
7 more people who are officially closed
Vera Lloyd (Boyce) 09 Jul 1915 State Registered Nurse Staff No
7 more people who are officially closed
Isabel Lynn (Smith) 05 Jan 1907 Assistant Nurse
7 more people who are officially closed
Elizabeth M Kavanagh (Roberts) 13 Aug 1914 Assistant Nurse
7 more people who are officially closed
Doreen Ward (Lamb) 16 Oct 1914 Assistant Nurse
7 more people who are officially closed
Elizabeth Smeaton (Jones) 25 Mar 1916 Assistant Nurse
7 more people who are officially closed
Dorothy Adderley 15 Jun 1919 Domestic Wardmaid
7 more people who are officially closed
Ref: RG101/4445E/002/43 Letter Code: NJAT
© Findmypast Ltd
Open a closed record Request a living person's record Close an open record Report an error

Elsie Hall married James Mitchell Nelson in 1933. Elsie gave birth to Leslie Nelson Hall in Dec 1934. James isn't on Leslie's birth certificate. I conclude from that James isn't the Father. Hence why she went to Oakhill Home.

Leslie is still alive and he gave me the above names.

Well as she didn't name a father on the birth cert then it's highly unlikely you will find his info

Again would think she wouldn't have given that info to the hospital when having her baby

If the lad was later adopted then his adoption file may give more info

Is your friend trying to find the info on Elsie or his dad?

Leslie was placed in Styal Cottage Homes now a Womens prison. Leslie is my Father In Law. I have records of his admission and discharges there.

He would like to know why he was placed in the orphanage. He was 3 years old. His Mum and James visited him until he was about 8. And in 1947 they went on a ship to New York and from there travelled on to Welland, Ontario.

It's me wanting to find out more info for him. Somewhere there are living descendents of his family in Northumberland but it's finding them. Whether they knew that Leslie exists I'm not sure about but it would be nice for him to have that contact.

it seems like james did not want him as a son

there is another elsie hall born in castle w Northumberland could this one have given birth to leslie


Births Dec 1905 (>99%)

Hall Elsie Castle W. 10b 375

found this for james going to u s a in 1947 with elsie she was born in lancashire


Elsie Nelson Immigration 1947 New York City, New York, United States Female Leigh Lancashire England Plane Nc 88865
James Mitchell Nelson Immigration 1947 New York City, New York, United States Male Walbottle Northd England



Births Dec 1908 (>99%)

Hall Elsie Leigh 8c 316

????

Nelson Household (1 Person) 13 Hope Street , Barrow-in-Furness C.B., Lancashire, England

Elsie Nelson 15 Nov 1908 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married 129 1
1 more person who is officially closed

EDIT wrong person as birthdate does not tally with travel information

This record is on FMP, and COULD be an answer as to why James didn't acknowledge Leslie if he was out of the country on a ship ..........


New York Passenger Lists & Arrivals Transcription

First name(s) James Mitchell
Last name Nelson
Sex Male
Age 35
Birth year 1910
Birth place British
Arrival year 1945
Arrival city New York
Arrival state New York
Arrival country United States
Ship name Raby Castle
Country United States
Film number 002310704
NARA roll number 6899
NARA publication number T715
Record set New York Passenger Lists & Arrivals
Category Travel & migration
Subcategory Passenger lists
Collections from United States & Canada

from image:-

Member of Crew (and also member of crew on ship's previous visit ot US)
Position:- 3rd Engineer
Time of Service at Sea:- 14 years <<<<<<<<<
5' 10"
163 lbs
Physical abnormalities:- Joint right hand amputated



New York Passenger Lists & Arrivals Transcription

First name(s) James Mitchell
Last name Nelson
Sex Male
Birth place Walbottle Northd England
Arrival year 1947
Arrival city New York
Arrival state New York
Arrival country United States
Ship name Plane Nc 88865
Country United States
Film number 002296197
NARA roll number 7460
NARA publication number T715
Record set New York Passenger Lists & Arrivals
Category Travel & migration
Subcategory Passenger lists
Collections from United States & Canada

from image:-
Elsie Nelson
Home Address:- 9 Richmond Terrace, Wallbottle, Northumberland
Date and Place of Birth:- 9 September 1908, Leigh, Lancashire
Name and Address of Nearest Relative at Home:- Father, Edward Hall, 18 Dene (or Done) Terrace, Walbottle
In transit to Ontario, Canada, 1 day
British Passport issued July 17 1947

James Mitchell Nelson
Date and Place of Birth:- June 28, 1909, Walbottle
Right third finger short
Nearest Relative at home:- Mother, Mrs Dorothy Nelson, 9 Richmond Terrace, Walbottle
In transit to Canada, 1 day
British Passport issued Aug 27 1942, at Bombay


and this must have been one of his first trips across the Atlantic ..........


Passenger Lists leaving UK 1890-1960 Transcription

First name(s) JAMES
Last name NELSON
Gender Male
Age 21
Birth year 1909
Occupation MARINE ENGINEER
Departure year 1930
Departure day 29
Departure month 8
Departure port LIVERPOOL
Destination port MONTREAL
Destination MONTREAL
Country CANADA
Destination country CANADA
Ship name ANDANIA
Ship official number 145934
Ship master's first name A C
Ship master's last name GREIG
Shipping line CUNARD
City LIVERPOOL
Ship destination port MONTREAL
Ship destination country CANADA
Ship square feet 11001
Ship registered tonnage 8391
Number of passengers 272
Record set Passenger Lists leaving UK 1890-1960
Category Travel & migration
Subcategory Passenger lists
Collections from Australia & New Zealand, United Kingdom, Ireland, United States & Canada

from image:-
Passenger
Address:- 9 Richmond Terrace, Walbottle
Cabin Passenger
Going to Montreal

Have you seen Elsie and James' marriage certificate?

If so, please can you tell us the name of her father, his occupation, and the names of witnesses?

Not sure if this is a red herring, only going by the coincidence of Dene Terrace, This Edward Hall would have to be a brother rather than a father if related....EDIT unless the birth years are mistranscribed, as he is retired.

from Sylvia's post

Elsie Nelson
Home Address:- 9 Richmond Terrace, Wallbottle, Northumberland
Date and Place of Birth:- 9 September 1908, Leigh, Lancashire
Name and Address of Nearest Relative at Home:- Father, Edward Hall, 18 Dene (or Done) Terrace, Walbottle<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
In transit to Ontario, Canada, 1 day
British Passport issued July 17 1947


1939 register:

Hall Household (3 People) 5 Dene Terrace , Hexham R.D., Northumberland, England

Edward Hall 14 Oct 1910 Male Raiway Foreman (Retired Married 28 1
Minnie Hall 02 Mar 1874 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married 28 2
Dora Tennick (Hall) 14 Oct 1914 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Single 28 3

HOWEVER I think the dates for Edward and Minnie are possibly wrong as they could read 10 & 14 for the year, or 90 and 94, or 70 and 74.

If this was the same family in 1911, they don't seem to have Elsie with them. The image also says 5 children born and still living, these are all accounted for on the census image:


1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census

6 Cotfield St Gateshead, Gateshead, Durham, England

Edward Hall Head Married Male Shed Turner Ry Loco Dept 40 1871 Cumberland Carlisle
Minnie Hall Wife Married Female - 36 1875 Durham Gateshead
Minnie Ann Hall Daughter Single Female - 18 1893 Durham Gateshead
Ada Louisa Hall Daughter Single Female - 16 1895 Durham Gateshead
John Hall Son - Male Insurance Clerk 14 1897 Durham Gateshead
Walter Hall Son - Male - 12 1899 Durham Gateshead
Edward Hall Son - Male - 7 1904 Durham Gateshead

I'll leave for elimination. Shame, as I was quite keen on the Dene Terrace connection.