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Thank you Austin Q & Londonbelle, I will speak with Roy & his wife Beryl tomorrow & see if they know any of this information. He did tell me he knows nothing about his Grandparents (on his father or mothers side) not even there names, but maybe this information might trigger something. As I mentioned Roy is 81 years old but very bright.I will ask him again if it was his father that died young as a result of an accident at work, maybe he means he was young (29 ) I think it might be worth sending for the death certificate that will give his cause of death to clear this up,I will ask him if I can.
Thank you both Ellen

We need to wait for that cert and then all will be revealed !!!

Dea Xxx

I have spoken with Roy this morning & it is ok for me to send for his father Edward Percy's death certificate.It was his father who died by a truck reversing back on him at his work ,As you say 62 is young nowadays

Roy's nephew that lives in Adelaide phoned me this morning he tells me he has the marriage certificate of Edward Percy & Alice Grace also Edward Percy's death,it says father James. What a shame I didn't hear from him earlier could have saved Roy $40.00 never mind I will get it in 2 weeks time

So it is looking more and more likely that Edward P's parents were James & Martha. Did the nephew give you any more info about the Certs or are you going to wait until you receive the Certs you ordered?

I am to email him with the information I have I will ask him to forward a copy of the Certificates to me I did tell him I had just sent for them. Will let you know if I get them

Rosaline married in 1911..........


Births Mar 1890 (>99%)
Freeman Rosaline Lewisham 1d 1217


Marriages Sep 1911 (>99%)
Freeman Rosaline Lewisham 1d 2306
Penfold Frederick J Lewisham 1d 2306

Rosaline Penfold in the London, England, Electoral Registers, 1832-1965
Name: Rosaline Penfold
Year: 1933
County or Borough: Lewisham
Ward or Division/Constituency: Lewisham
Street address: 83 Elderton Road

With husband Frederick James and son Frederick Robert James.......

Son born Frederick J R Freeman

Births Jun 1912 (>99%)
Penfold Frederick J R Freeman Lewisham 1d 2106

Rosaline Penfold in the London, England, Electoral Registers, 1832-1965 Name: Rosaline Penfold
Year: 1934
County or Borough: Lewisham
Ward or Division/Constituency: Lewisham
Street address: 83 Elderton Road

With husband Frederick James and son William Ernest....

Son born Ernest William Freeman

Births Jun 1913 (>99%)
Penfold Ernest W Freeman Lewisham 1d 2193

If you take a look on FreeBMD, you will see there are lots of other Penfold/Freeman births in Hastings and Lewisham between 1911--1927

http://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl

??

Rose Penfold in the England & Wales, Death Index, 1916-2007
Name: Rose Penfold
Birth Date: abt 1891
Date of Registration: Jun 1967
Age at Death: 76
Registration district: Lewisham
Inferred County: London
Volume: 5d
Page: 294

Son Frederick preferred to go by the name of Frederick Robert James.......


Marriages Dec 1933 (>99%)
Leeder Florence M Penfold Lewisham 1d 2018
Penfold Frederick R J Leeder Lewisham 1d 2018


Frederick Robert Penfold in the London, England, Electoral Registers, 1832-1965
(Frederick Robert James on the image)
Name: Frederick Robert Penfold
Year: 1939
County or Borough: Lewisham
Ward or Division/Constituency: Lewisham West
Street address: 83 Elderton Road

With wife Florence May


Frederick Robert J Penfold in the England & Wales, Death Index, 1916-2007
Name: Frederick Robert J Penfold
Birth Date: 2 Mar 1912
Date of Registration: Sep 1988
Age at Death: 76
Registration district: Braintree
Inferred County: Essex
Volume: 9
Page: 1343

There does not appear to be any Freeman/Leeder births registered.

You are right Austin...........

I got my 8s and 9s in a muddle!

To avoid confusion, I will delete that info.

easily done!! I'll delete too

Finally received the Marriage Certificate for Edward Percy Freeman & Alice Grace Tolhurst ( Nephew didn't get back to me with his ) 25/12/1929 at St Michael & All Angels Sydenham
Father James Deceased Labourer.
His death 18/3/1964 aged 61 years died of Multiple Crushing injuries of the chest accidental death at Sidcup & (could be Kent?)
Builders Yard Manager
There was an inquest on the 24/3/1964 at Surrey I contacted National Archives but they say I have to contact Surrey Coroners Court does anyone know their email address that I might contact them & obtain a copy?

With regards to the Marriage Cert, what were the addresses given for the couple and what were the names of the Witnesses?

https://www.surreycc.gov.uk/people-and-community/birth-death-marriage-and-civil-partnerships/death/surrey-coroner/contact-the-surrey-coroner

(always worth a 'google search' for things!. Brings up above, it does state below)

Chris :)


Records:
Records of Surrey Coroners' cases can be found at Surrey History Centre and The National Archives.
Please note: If a death occurred more than 75 years ago then any record is open to public inspection; if the death was less than 75 years ago then, subject to the coroner's permission, the record is open to those who have a "proper interest".


edits (thinks address should be Beaulah Hill. Freemans coming up 'Electoral' (Ancestry) 77, Elderton)

Edward Percy Freeman address is 77 Elderton Road. Alice Grace Tolhurst 1 Beulat Hill Upper Norwood Witness's William George Garnet & Emily Tolhurst I think she would be Alice Grace's sister born Emily Frances born 24th March 1910 Lewisham.

Thank you for the Surrey History Centre address I have sent a email off to them hoping they might help Roy.

Hi Ellen,
I have been following your story/research with interest.
This has opened another branch of the family for me.
My Grandmother was Hilda Freeman born 1898 in Norwich
Your James Freeman 1846 is in my Family tree, He was born Watson's Yard, King Street Norwich to John Freeman 1824 born Aylsham, Norfolk & Hannah Brooks 1825 also Alysham, Norfolk.
I have 51 Freemans in my tree so far, if you need any info on the Norwich Line, Please get in touch.
Regards,
Mike.

(a possible Norfolk/Norwich Baptism for James on below, John occ. Boat Builder, but best to check with Mike first!, if you're interested. On 1851)

http://www.freereg.org.uk/


Births Sep 1846 (>99%)
-----------------------------------------------
Freeman James Norwich 13 242

Chris :)

As no response, I have sent pm message to Ellen.
Well done to all for all the info,
I now have another branch to my tree.