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Getting desparate,cannot get a lead at all on John,the only information I have is that he and his wife Polly Cook,lived at Heisehope reservoir Waskerley Muggleswick Registration district Lanchester,we know this because we have his son Georges birth certificate.George had several brothers and sisters.Then they moved to Ripponden/Halifax because George married Gladys Pearson in 1928 At Ripponden Parish Church and Thomas is classed as retired then.The brothers and sisters of George are Charles Arthur Ernie Tommy Johnny,and the sisters are Millicent Lily Annie.
I know the family worked on roads and public buildings ets
Its a real Puzzler
Patricia

So when was George born?

Patricia

found the following on www.lancashirebmd.org.uk but it's Thomas ALLEN not John Thomas. If it's your man, a copy marriage cert will give his age and his father's name.


In the results below, the reference number will be a link to a printable application which can be used to order the certificate for the index entry. Full details of the charges and the Register Office address can be found on the form.


Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1901
Surname Forename(s) Surname Forename(s) Church / Register Office Registers At Reference

COOK Polly ALLEN Thomas Lancaster, Heysham, St Peter Preston CE8/1/311

could this be the marriage?
Name: Polly Cook
Year of Registration: 1901
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
District: Lancaster
County: Lancashire
Volume: 8e
Page: 1212
Thomas Allen is one of the names on the index page

John Thomas is his name that what it says on Georges birth certificate,and george was born 11/4/1903 George was not the eldest son,I think Tommy was the first.I believe they spent their latter years in Ripponden or Halifax.and we know absolutely nothing about Polly.I am beginning to think they were travellers,who moved around the country,do roadworks etc

possible birth index for Millicent
Name: Millicent Ruby J Allen
Year of Registration: 1904
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
District: Lanchester (1875-1938)
County: Durham
Volume: 10a
Page: 365

BUT he may not have used both names all the time!

He may have been John on some records


Thomas on others


and then John Thomas elsewhere



He may have been registered at birth with only one name and the second added at baptism.



You find all sorts of things when you are looking at our ancestors ........ I sometimes think they did it deliberately just to make life difficult for us!



In other words, never rule anything out because it doesn't fit what you know or what a rellie has told you!

If date and place seem to fit, it is worth at least a second or a third look.


The other day I was helping someone find rellies on several censuses. We could not find them on 3 censuses, BUT another couple with the same christian names, birth years and place, did keep appearing. I finally took a close look at those entries.


Yep ................ was the family, just decided to change their surname apparently just before their only child was born. The child reverted to the original name when he left home, but the parents stayed with the new name until the husband died, then the wife reverted to the old name and was buried under it about 10 years later.

Why? Who knows!!!



Just a reminder to be flexible in all things


sylvia

Thankyou will follow things up
Regards Patricia

success thanks to you,it is our Millie and our John Thomas
Thankyou so much
Patricia

I have collected John and Pollys marriage certificate,John was 42 ,his father was John Allen,Polly was 26 her Father was Richard Cook,with them marrying at Heysham could it be they came over on the ferry from Ireland????????

1881 free to search. could this be herName: Polly Cook
Age: 5
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1876
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Richard
Mother's Name: Mary Ann
Gender: Female
Where born: Hull, Yorkshire, England

Civil Parish: Kingston-Upon-Hull
County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England



Name: Richard Cook
Age: 32
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1849
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Mary Ann
Gender: Male
Where born: Lynn, Norfolk, England

Civil Parish: Kingston-Upon-Hull
County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England

Name: Mary Ann Cook
Age: 30
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1851
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: Richard
Gender: Female
Where born: Boston, Lincoln, England

Civil Parish: Kingston-Upon-Hull

Household Members: Name Age
Charlott Cook 6
Elizabeth Cook 12
Emma Cook 14
Mary Ann Cook 30
Polly Cook 5
Richard Cook 32
Richard Cook 13
Spaleman Cook 4

What were the occupations on the marriage cert?
Are the witness names any help in finding John?

Sorry his name is down as Thomas his job is a Blacksmith Polly has no job,witnesses are John William North and Emma North.I have sent for Millies birth certificate so hopefully that might tell me a little more.
Getting quite excited cos I have not been able to get on the Allen trail.Thanks to you

fascinated by the Cook childrens name maybe the right track George has the second christian name
Spilman

This looks like the Cook family in Heysham in 1901 Polly must be working away from the family
Name: Richard Cook
Age: 50
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1851
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Mary A
Gender: Male
Where born: Kings Lynn, Norfolk, England

Civil Parish: Heysham
Ecclesiastical parish: Heysham St Peter
Town: Heysham
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Name: Mary A Cook
Age: 49
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1852
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: Richard
Gender: Female
Where born: Boston, Lincolnshire, England

Civil Parish: Heysham
Ecclesiastical parish: Heysham St Peter
Town: Heysham
County/Island: Lancashire
Household Members: Name Age
Charles H Cook 14
James W Cook 10
John D Cook 12
Mary A Cook 49
Richard Cook 50
Walter Holliday 17 -Boarder
Peter Jones 50 -Boarder
James Smith 24 -Relation: Boarder

Richard is a General Labourer.
living at Lancaster View.

Did they have different addresses to each other on their marriaqge cert?

no no addresses just says place of residence Heysham ?

certainly didn't want to give you many clues then did they!

SO WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE.ALLEN IS THE NAME I AM REALLY INTERESTED IN MUST BE GYPSIES TRAVELLERS OR EVEN IRISH,WELL MUST KEEP ON TRYING,AT LEAST YOU HAVE SOLVED THE COOK SECTOR FOR WHICH I AM GRATEFUL,SAD BECAUSE I HAVE PHOTOS AND HAVENT A CLUE WHO THE ARREGARDS PATRICIA

well just for your records it looks like emma North could be her sister from 1881 census . This is the only one i could find in 1901
Name: Emma North
Age: 33
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1868
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: John W
Gender: Female
Where born: Kings Lymn, Norfolk, England

Civil Parish: Heysham
Ecclesiastical parish: Heysham St Peter
Town: Heysham
Name: John W North
Age: 42
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1859
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Emma
Gender: Male
Where born: Telford, Lincolnshire, England

Civil Parish: Heysham
Ecclesiastical parish: Heysham St Peter
Town: Heysham
Emma North 33
Eva M North 6
George H North 8
John R North 11
John W North 42
Samuel North 1

http://www.heyshamweb.co.uk/index.html
Just found this interesting site. There is a picture of the blacksmiths about 1900!
I see why it only says Heysham as address on the cert. It certainly looks like it might have been a small village. Perhaps you might like to contact someone through that site to see if there are any records that might help in your search