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Thanks so much Ivy - it is a start anyway!!

Belinda

There were 35 Elizabeth Griffiths (no middle initial) born in the Merthyr RD between 1851 and 1861. Those that were registered with a middle name tend not to be credited with it on the census.

Aside from the Carmathen born EG mentioned above, the only other EG born in that time frame and living in the Merthyr RD in 1861 with Benjamin as a father is living in Aberdare:

Name: Elizabeth Griffithes
Age: 1
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1860
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Benjamin
Mother's Name: Eliza
Gender: Female
Where born: Aberdare, Glamorgan, Wales

Civil Parish or Township: Aberdare
Town: Aberdare
County/Island: Glamorgan
Country: Wales

Registration district: Merthyr Tydfil
Sub-registration district: Aberdare
ED, institution, or vessel: 13

Household schedule number: 37
Household Members:
Name Age
Benjamin Griffithes 40
Benjamin Griffithes 11
Eliza Griffithes 39
Elizabeth Griffithes 1
Emma Williams 21
Evan Williams 26

There are however another 10 where the father's name is not given.

Hi Belinda,

I haven't found anything that clearly matches EJG before 1881. The census entries as Hiram's wife are:

1881: age 24, b Glamorgan, Glamorganshire, soldier's wife, Woolwich (son Albert also born Glamorgan in Glamorganshire)
1891: age 34, b Glamorganshire, Wales, wife, Plumstead (son Albert born Treorchy in Wales)
1901: age 43, b Merthyr Tydvil, Glam (interpreted by Ancestry as Merther Tydvil, Gloucestershire, England), Plumstead (son Albert no longer at home)

Hi Ivy

Wow - great powers of deduction there. It sounds like the Merthyr Tydfil certificate would be the one to get.

I think Benjamin was still alive when Elizabeth married in 1877 as he is not stated as deceased on the marriage certificate whereas Elizabeth's father in law is stated as deceased. So that should be enough proof!!!

I would be interested to see the actual census records for Elizabeth Jane and her parents if possible.

Thanks so much for your help Ivy!

Kind regards
Belinda

The Holywell EJG (Flintshire) might be linked to the death registration in March 1861 in Holywell, which could explain why this one does not appear in 1861. Similarly, there is a death in Mar 1859 of an EJG in Abergavenny.

That then leaves Neath and Merthyr births as possibles.

There is also an Elizabeth Jane Griffiths born abt 1858, born and living in Cadoxton, Neath, d of John and Mary Griffiths, which be a match to your Neath birth listed above.

- and Elizabeth states Merthyr as her birthplace in 1901.

I'd be inclined to get the Merthyr birth certificate.

Btw, is there anything to confirm that Benjamin was still alive when Elizabeth married? She might not be with her father in 1861 (and there is a Welsh EG living in London in 1871).

Looking for Eliz* Griff* born in Wales between 1855 and 1859 to Benj*, Ancestry offers 3 for 1861:

The daughter of B+Hannah (b abt 1858) is born and living in Burton in Pembrokeshire (reg dist Pembroke) - prob not an Eliz* Jane since there is no match to your list above;

the daughter of B+Caroline (b abt 1859) is born and living Glamorgan - Morriston for the birth and living in Llangyfelach (Swansea RD) in 1861 - I'll check the RD for Morriston in a mo;

and perhaps the most likely, Elizabeth J Griffiths, daughter of B+ Elizabeth, born in Langhurne, Carmarthenshire abt 1857 and living in 1861 in Merthyr Tydfil in Glamorgan. If this is the one you are looking for, it may explain why Kath could not match a census entry to the Carmarthen birth.

[Ed: nope, that theory demolished by finding the third one still with her parents in 1881 in Ystradyfodwg]

[Ed: and Morriston is a suburb of Swansea (in Llangyfelach), so it looks like the second family have not moved, and the birth would be in the Swansea RD)]

Hi Kath,

I think you're right about Treorchy. I tried using the Ancestry advanced search facility to look for Jones born in Wales in Treorchy (county omitted), and came up with very few before 1901. Those there were in 1891 seem to be mainly living in Ystradyfodwg, Glamorgan, which is indeed in the Pontypridd registration district.

And Pontypridd is in Glamorgan! I wonder if Elizabeth was born in the same town or somewhere else!

I think I found a birth for Albert - the only one in Wales:

Births Dec 1877 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

EARNSHAW Albert Pontypridd 11a 426


So mayb

I did the search that Ivy suggested but nothing came up.

I can't find which registration district covers Treorchy, but it is not too far from Pontypridd, so it could be that one.

I think it is going to be very difficult with such a common name.

Kath. x

Ok, thanks Kath and Ivy for the ideas. I haven't actually got access to Ancestry census records, so can't do the search you suggest above. Not really sure what to do next really. Anyone have any ideas?

Hi Belinda

If you take the name of each of these registration districts and use it as the "keyword" in Ancestry searches on the 1861 Wales census while looking for Elizabeth Jane Griffiths born around 1857ish, this should pick out the towns and villages that are in that registration district
(hope that reads right, I'm going squiffy-eyed - I'm sure someone else can put it better....

On the 1881 census it gives the same birthplace for Elizabeth Jane and the son Albert. However in the 1891 census it gives the birthplace of Albert as Treorchy (although this has been transcribed as Treverbyn), so perhaps that is also where Elizabeth was born. Just a thought.

Kath. x

Hi all

I have an Elizabeth Jane Griffiths who was born around 1857 in Glamorgan, Glamorgan, Wales according to census records. She married Hiram Earnshaw in 1877 and I have recently received the marriage certificate. Elizabeth's father is named as Benjamin Griffiths, Coal Miner and the family were living at Scotswood, Newcastle in 1877.

My puzzle is that I have to match Elizabeth Jane Griffiths to the correct birth record using the 1861 census records to help possibly. None of these births are in Glamorgan but maybe some of the districts are close to Glamorgan? The family were more likely to be living close to Elizabeth's place of birth in 1861. I know there are masses of Elizabeth Griffiths with father's Benjamin in the 1861 census - but if someone is able to match up a few details here it would be much appreciated.

The possible births around 1857 are as follows:

Surname First name(s) District Vol Page

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Births Dec 1856 (>99%)
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Griffiths Elizabeth Jane Holywell 11b 268

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Births Mar 1857 (>99%)
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Griffiths Elizabeth Jane Carmarthen 11a 596

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Births Sep 1857 (96%)
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Griffiths Elizabeth Jane Abergavenny 11a 103

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Births Jun 1858 (>99%)
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Griffiths Elizabeth Jane Neath 11a 497



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Births Dec 1858 (>99%)
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Griffiths Elizabeth Jane Merthyr T. 11a 271



Thanks very much
Belinda