Genealogy Chat

I havent got that close yet Pippa. The only ones I can find are in the midlands UK. Your surnames sudders and Pidgeon LOOK like they maybe black...ish. My Ford and Pilliner dont :-( By the way...Im blond and fair skinned like my Canadian father but brown eyed. eg: My middle daughter that was born with brown eyes...They say that only black..ish children are born with brown eyes! There are three of us from my Mother all with different fathers. Now there lies another story! ;-) lol Good luck with your searching Pippa. Gerri x

My Sudder family have the same kind of features as the ones that you describe! We all come from Jacob Sudders who married Alice Pidgeon in Gorleston in 1800. According to the 1851 census he was born in Prussia (nice big area to search!). Up to my Great Grandad they were all very tall, very dark hair (black) and very sallow skinned. There are family rumours of Mongolian influences but who really knows! Did your ancestors live near a port? Pippa

Wow you clever lot! Many thanks for taking the time to help me. My Elizabeth Pilliner was married in 1877 in Walsall and it looks like 24 or it might be 21. It isnt very clear. They both lived in Wolverhampton Lane, Walsall. Henry Ford has his father shown as John Ford (deceased) also his profession. You'd think he would have told his wife to be to enter her father the same way! Now for the reason I started this hobby.... Somewhere in the Ford line we have forin blood. (plz excuse spelling lol) My Grandfather looked Indian..ish His daughter (my Mum) and her brother had very olive skin and dark features. We ALL have brown eyes.My daughter was BORN with very dark brown eyes. My sister has sallow looking skin colour. It looks like the gene is fading. My grandfather when asked, would only laugh as he told us we have continental blood. Thats all he would say!!! Elizabeth Pilliner would have been his Mother. So that is why it was important to find her parents. Looking at what you all found....It doesnt look like it was the Pilliner line. I once found a John Ford born in India but I couldnt match up his details to ours. So it looks like it's back to the drawing board again...ho!hum! Many many thanks again to you all. Gerri x

I see from Freebmd that they married in the Walsall district which would make this young lady on the 1871 census a possiblility: Census place: Bilston Staffordshire Elizabeth Pillener 15 born Sedgley, Staffs She was living with parents Samuel 44(born Grendon Bishop,Herefordshire) and Elizabeth 46(born Shropshire) and younger siblings Samuel, Sarah, George and Mary This may all be coincidental but by 1881 there is no sign of an Elizabeth Pill*ner aged 25 and young Sarah and Mary were living with their widowed mother Elizabeth Pilliner in Handsworth, Staffs, which would tie in with this being your Elizabeth's family and her father being deceased at the time of her wedding. This family also appear in Bilston in the 1861 census, when Elizabeth was 5. As well as them and the family in Grendon Bishop that Fiona found there is a third possiblility in 1861: Elizabeth Pilliner aged 7, born in Edvin Ralph, Herefordshire, daughter of James and Ann Pilliner. As the others have said, you really now need an age and place of birth for Elizabeth from a later census to compare her with the entries we have found.

There are approx 40 Elizabeth Ford's on the 1881 census who are the wife of a Henry Ford. Presumably you know which one of these couples is yours? If you can post the correct family here then someone should be able to help (or at least try!). Fiona has already posted a couple of possible Elizabeth Pilliners, but as this name sounds very easy to mistranscribe, perhaps neither of these is the one?! (If one is, then bravo!!). So we need to know what she has stated for her age and birthplace on ever census where you have found her with her husband. As her maiden surname isn't common there's a very good chance of finding her. Merry

I have a few marriage certificates that are blank regarding the father of the bride/groom too. One for sure I know is illegitimate, having bought his birth certificate. The others are blank because their father was deceased at the time of the marriage. I had to root about a bit in the early censuses and piece it all together, but I have come up with fathers for them. And in the case of one ancestor, I already knew who both her father and step-father were, but she didn't give either! Sometimes it will say (deceased) after the father's name, and sometimes the father's name is actually incorrect!!! Oh, and I have one who did give his father's name but can I find him anywhere??? Dead? Incorrect? Who knows? So, I guess what I'm saying is dig around and find all the evidence you can from censuses, IGI and other certificates and the try and piece it all together. Lesley

Hi Gerri, what was her age when she married and where did she marry? There is this one in 1871. View Record Elizabeth Pilliner abt 1847 Brompton, Middlesex, England Head Battersea London View Record Thos Benj Pilliner abt 1836 London, Middlesex, England Brother Battersea London Address is 4 Cairns Road, Elizabeth is single and a Teacher. Or there is this one in 1861, think it means Step Daughter and not Daughter-in-law the girls only 9!! View Record Anne Gurney abt 1848 Grendon Bishop, Herefordshire, England Daughter Grendon Bishop Herefordshire View Record Caroline Gurney abt 1860 Grendon Bishop, Herefordshire, England Daughter Grendon Bishop Herefordshire View Record Jane Gurney abt 1854 Grendon Bishop, Herefordshire, England Daughter Grendon Bishop Herefordshire View Record March Gurney abt 1856 Grendon Bishop, Herefordshire, England Daughter Grendon Bishop Herefordshire View Record Selina Gurney abt 1829 Grendon Bishop, Herefordshire, England Wife Grendon Bishop Herefordshire View Record William Gurney abt 1821 Pencombe, Herefordshire, England Head Grendon Bishop Herefordshire View Record Elizabeth Pilliner abt 1852 Grendon Bishop, Herefordshire, England Daughter-in-law Grendon Bishop Herefordshire

Hi Gerri I think I see what you mean....The details of father are blank? It looks as if your Elizabeth might be illigitamate. My ggrandmother was illigitamate and you may never find her father in which case you will have no where to go. You may be able to find her with her mother and follow that line. Did the marriage cert give her age? Ill assume you have found her on the 1881 and following censuses with her husband Henry? If yes then you will know roughly her birth year and whereabouts she was born? Track down her birth certificate which will tell you for certain if she was illigitamate. Alternatively check the censuses before she was married to see if you can find her with any parents on them? Hope this makes sense. Suzanne

Hi Gerri Not to sure of exact info you want but What I would do is from the marriage cert (its should give you her fathers name and profession?) search the 1871 census for her living with her parents and keep going back through the censuses, collecting info as you go. Hope that makes sense? Suzanne

I have a marriage cert for my grandfathers parents. I want to look down the line of Elizabeth Pilliner, married Henry Ford on the 14 Feb1877. fathers name and surname.. _____ Rank or Profession of father_________..Fathers name and surname ________ Where do I go now??

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