Genealogy Chat

Perhaps a how long is a piece of string question! In England were people ever known by just one name? For example 'Johnson' and that was that? How far back is it possible to trace your ancestors? How far have some people got? When does a typical parish register 'begin'? Thanks!

Very briefly surnames as we know them came into being in the early 1200's. Names could come from birth place eg John of London who became John London. From nickname William (the) Brown from his hair colour. From occupation eg Peter (the) Smith. From relationship eg Alan Johns son. Parish records started in about 1640 ish and you can get back before then. There are two well documented cases of people who have their (verified) tree stretching back to the Emperor Charlemagne. You have a way to go!! Regards Keith

Always be a bit suspicious of people who have traced their family back a long way especially if they have been using 'members' submissions' on the IGI. You can proibably get back to Adam using those! MB

Although surnames were introduced in the 1200s, they did not generally become common, or consistent until the late 1400s, or even later than that in some cases. The poorer you were, the less likely you would be to have a consistent surname. Before about 1600, most people outside London lived either in a Manor, or under its jurisdiction. If you had a hundred men called John, depending on where they were and who was doing the asking, they might be John Thomas-son as opposed to John James-son. In the village they might be known as John (the) Smith, or John (the) Redhead. If they ventured many miles from home they might be known as John de Lancaster. The Great and the Good, who had Manors, or substantial land-holdings, often took their surnames from the Manor. My ancestors are the Holdens, who held Holden Manor, which was based in the (now tiny) village of Holden, in Lancashire. I have documentary evidence that they were using Holden as a surname BEFORE they came into possession of the Manor in 1179. The National Archives hold documents going back to the year 879 (I think), so, in theory, SOMEONE ought to be able to trace their ancestors back that far. The other point is, if you do get back that far, don't forget that your genes are so diluted by then, it hardly matters if you get the wrong person - they are almost bound to turn up in your tree somewhere! Marjorie

Marjorie, that is interesting. Does that mean my Horstead lot from Norfolk once held some sort of authority in the village of Horstead, Norfolk (by the 18th century none of them lived there but in a radius of about 15 miles) or that they were just 'Thomas from Horstead'? Suppose we will never know!

Unfortunately I have not inherited much of my 'Gaunt' gene, or I would not need to diet. Still, at least I do not have too much of the 'Beard' one!