General Chat

I am in total agreement with what She has said. Catholics do not worship the Pope , and whatever peoples' religion he has given a lot to the world. Iz x

i dont understand the catholic faith as i brought up a methodist. although now i dont practice any religion. my eldest son however ,has converted to islam! he is bringing his 4 children up as muslims which i greatly respect. i have read parts of the koran and its almost identical to the bible. as you stated chloe,abraham is called ibrahim,which incidently is my grandsons name lol. in the koran,jesus is regarded as a very high prophet and is worshipped. i respect anyones religion and admire them for following a faith. susie

I understand what is being said Chloe but maybe tonight is a bit unsensitive to ask why is the Pope so Holy? I think you only have to look round the world christians of all denominations also non christians around the world paying this great man his due respects,is that not testimony enough to the mans esteem? Dave

I don't think it's insensitive. It sad that he is dying. But it is not the death of Catholicism and he has led a great life. Why be sad? I didn't mean to say THE POPE, I meant ALL popes, not just John Paul II. It's stated in the opening thread. I'm not attacking Catholicism or John Paull II. If this is not a good time for debate, then when is there a good time? John Paul II has lead a great, meaningful and long life. Why be sad? Why mourn him like he was your best friend or your father? I find it difficult to understand. Plus the fact, he has not even passed away yet and people are talking like he is already gone.

Chloe, there's nothing wrong with your question. A genuine attempt to understand another's point of view is neither inappropriate nor offensive. Catholics - I'm not one - don't 'worship' the Pope, just as they don't worship the Virgin Mary (they ask her to intercede on their behalf: even in death mothers still nag their sons!). Infallibility doesn't mean sinlessness and it only applies to the doctrines of the Church. In other words, it means that when the Pope makes a solemn pronouncement about faith or morals, he is guarded by the Holy Spirit (and years of theological study) against teaching error. So when a Pope declared the Immaculate Conception to be an infallible teaching, this is what Catholics must accept to be true. The Pope cannot say that drinking Pepsi or buying a holiday cottage in Spain is wrong, and call it an infallible teaching. The aim is to give him the final word on doctrinal disputres and preventthe Catholic Church from disintegrating into factions.

Thanks Twinkle. Do you know how a pope is chosen? What defines someone so that they become a pope?

The Pope is chosen by a conclave of Cardinals who are the highest ranking clergymen in the catholic church after the Pope after a period of mourning for the late Pope. The event is signalled by a puff of smoke! Davex

But Dave, how do these clergymen/cardinals know which is the right man for the 'job'? Are they directed by God?

What wonderful questions Chloe! The new pope is chosen by the cardinals who, I believe, are closeted in a room in the Vatican to pray and vote silently. I'm not sure of the exact procedure but I also know that while the 'choosing' is going on each day there is a fire burning at the Vatican and at the end of each day if the smoke is black a new pope has not been chosen and if the smoke is white a new pope has been chosen. Also, there is no obligation on the man chosen to accept. Apparently the chosen cardinal goes into a room where new shoes are available to him. If he emerges wearing the shoes he has accepted the papacy; if not nothing is said and the cardinals just carry on with the process of making their choice. It is believed that whomsoever the cardinals chose, it is 'God's will', though some years ago when a pope died after being in office for only 33 days there were some suggestions that this was God's way of saying that he was not happy!! It's many years since I was a practicing Catholic so I'm open to correction if I've got any of this wrong. :-)

Sorry Dave, didn't mean to butt in there!

I think you will find it is regarded as respect and devotion to a man who has done an amazing amount of good. As a Catholic I do not 'worship' the Pope more than I do God. Any estalishment be it religious, eductional, occupational or governmental has a a hierarchichal construction that means inevitably there is a 'man at the top'. In catholocism we happen to be blessed with an icredibile type of human being who has devoted his life to the service of others. He may live in luxurious surroundings but he isn't a man of wealth living the high life at the disadvantage of others. When he passes he will be as poor as the day he took his vows. Despite the fact the questions arent meant to cause offence they have with me. You are putting questions about a persons faith, their lifetime of belief and asking them to justify them. I live in an area of the country where sectarianism is a major problem. It's leads to violence among grown men and schoolchildren being allocated schools based on their religion,all due to a lack of tolerance and understanding. I have to watch Orange marches out of my front window - but I value the right of the protestant community to display their beliefs in this way if thats what they want to do, despite the history and meaning behind it. I dont question others in an accusatory manner about their beliefs . I just wish that that others could show the same regard. If your question isn't timed to coincide with the Pope's ill health then why not include those who 'worship' Dalai Lama? Your timing is way out and thoughtless. Zoe

I suppose Chloe these cardinals will be directed by God only they will know wont they? Davex

Mother Theresa Gwynne

I mentioned her earlier, Mother Theresa on the 6th September 1997, and no I did not google, I remember it very vividly. Dave - thanks for the answer, and to you too, Felicity.

Im sorry Chloe I do tend to agree with Zoe your timing is not very good sweetheart! Dave

Mother Theresa of Calcutta

Christopher why are you making out that we are thick of course we know Mother Theresa died the same week as Princess Diana dont be so insulting and retract your remark! Dave

That's up to the individual. I'm not talking about John Paul II specifically. I was trying to widen my perspective on the world and the people in it. The situation of John Paul II did spur me to write this message, if I had left it longer, I would have forgotten, I have a terrible memory for anything non genealogy!

Zoe - I'm sorry to have caused offence. I was not saying that people had to justify their beliefs AT ALL. I was not saying 'there is no God'. As for sectarianism - I'm not trying to create it. I'm trying to understand. I hate the fact that all the religions are seen as different to each other when they all have the same BASIC ideas. Judaism, Christianity and Islam are prime examples. Ok - let's widen the question to the Dalai Lama then..... I didn't mean worship to the extent that you have taken it. I should have been clearer. The pope, along with Jesus, Muhammad, Dalai Lama etc are all put up on a pedestal.... I was asking why that was. Shouldn't the great concern be with God, and push the others aside, and focus solely on God/Allah/Buddha etc. I don't see how that can be bad timing. A question about religion..... maybe I should have widen the view point and not specifically put it on Catholicism, for that I am sorry. Chloe

I'm very sorry to see that Zoe is offended by what seemed to me perfectly natural and innocent questions. To my mind, there is no 'right' or 'wrong' time to ask these things. The Pope's health is in the news, prompting those who do not know to ask 'what next?' As for justifying one's beliefs, surely we wouldn't hold them if we felt they couldn't be justified. I am so sorry that sectarianism is such an issue, it is a dreadful way to have to live, but honestly I personally don't see Chloe's questions as accusatory or intimidating. So far as I can see she's just a bright intelligent person asking for information.