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Ok Gins,that rules her out.

Just noticed this Joseph Garner/Joseph Bickley mums nee Baitrum same reg numbers V1b P526 J/A/S 1931 Hackney.

1935 34,Essex Street Hackney
Maud Bickley
Joseph Bickley

Death Maud Bickley born @ 1901 died 1942 Shoreditch

Maryb.

Mary, I think you may have cracked part of the mystery.


Household (1 Person)
34 Shenfield Street , Shoreditch, London, England

Joseph A C Bickley 17 Jan 1900 Male Builders Labourer Married 58 1

Maud is not showing on the 1939 but she is with the above Joseph on the London ER (same address as above)

Joseph Andrew C Bickley
Birth Date: 17 Jan 1900
Date of Registration: Nov 1990
Age at Death: 90
Registration district: Waltham Forest
Inferred County: London
Volume: 15
Page: 721

Well done Mary! That death looks quite hopeful as this looks like a marriage for Joseph A C

Joseph A Bickley
Spouse Surname: Connard
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1944
Registration district: Shoreditch
Inferred County: Middlesex
Volume Number: 1c
Page Number: 61
Find Spouse: Sarah J Connard

Nice work Mary! :)

I'm guessing Maud was keeping a low profile (why we can't find her 1939) as she was not married to Joseph

Just realised that Lynn has not responded to the information. I'll drop her a message

Cheers guys.
I was wondering if this is son Joseph Bickley 1931

Joseph Beckley 1931 died June 1936 Dartford kent V2a P244.
I can't see a birth for Joseph Beckley.

Sarah J Bickley died 25/3/1966 Enfield probate etc names husband Joseph Andrew Charles Bickley £697

Just seen Lynn has Joseph Bickley 1900 in her tree!!has she just added it or did she already know.

Maryb.

Here's Sarah in 1939. Her surname Connard is there and crossed out and her date of marriage is written at the side.

136 Shepherdess Walk , Shoreditch, London, England

FIRST NAME(S) LAST NAME(S)
Sarah Jane Bickley
DOB 11 Sep 1914
SEX Female
OCCUPATION Dyer (Mens Braces)
MARITAL STATUS Single
SCHEDULE 121
SCHEDULE SUB NUMBER 4

John Edward Vorpes
Rosina Vorpes
Sorry, this record is officially closed. Check if you can open a closed record.

Different spelling on Sarah's birth reg.

Sarah J Cannard
Mother's Maiden Name: Taylor
Registration Year: 1914
Registration Quarter: Jul-Aug-Sep
Registration district: Holborn
Inferred County: London
Volume: 1b
Page: 1124

Joseph A C Bickley born 1900 limehouse Middlesex
1901 dad Joseph.
1911 dad Benjamin 1869 and Ellen married 14 years.

A Benjamin Bickley married Lizzie Baitrum A/M/J 1940 Shorditch 1e 178.
She was maybe Elizabeth ??

Maryb.

Hi everyone

Firstly, thank you so much for all your hard work - really amazing!

Here's some further info: Maud was the daughter of Albert and Eliza Baitrum. Eliza died in 1907and Albert in 1910 due, it seems, to the 'demon drink'. They had 8 children several of whom were babies/small children when they died. They weren't put into care as the rest of the family took them in. My g-grandmother, Alice, who was Albert's sister, fostered two for many years.

Maud was cared for by her brother, George, and his 'lodger' Eliza whom he subsequently married. George died on the Somme in 1916.

I don't know what happened to her next until 1925 when she married Fred Garner. She had a daughter, Helen Louise, in 1926 in the Brentford area and Joseph in 1931 in Hackney.

Fred and Maud were living at 47 Rushmore Road 1931-33 and then at 36 Sussex Road, Harrow-on-the-Hill 1934/36. Fred was fathering children with Emma Cockram throughout that time.

In the 1939 register Fred was on his own at Granville Avenue, Spelthorne, Feltham working as a window cleaner. Helen was at Elmer Gardens with the name of Hipgrave in brackets. This is really odd as she married a Cecil Hipgrave from Hereford Road, Spelthorne in 1952. Any suggestions on that one would be very welcome!

I have also noticed that Joseph Garner and Joseph Bickley have the same registration details. Maud's niece, Lizzie Baitrum, married Benjamin Bickley in 1940. Was Joseph B their son?

I suspect that Joseph and Maud Bickley may be a red herring but I'll see if I can find a marriage.

I've ordered several marriage and birth certificates to try and unravel this mystery. I'll keep you posted. Thanks again for all your suggestions.

Lynn

Lynn ........

The 1939 Register was used as the basis of the NHS (National Health Scheme) that came into being in 1947. It was therefore kept up to date until at least 1991, and occasionally later, with marriages and deaths being entered when found on the UK bmd. The information was added by hand as it became available.

Women on the FMP transcripts were indexed under their later married name with the maiden name in brackets.

So this is the Register Transcription as shown on FMP ...................

Hipgrave (Garner) Household (1 Person)
18 Elmer Gardens , Heston and Isleworth M.B., Middlesex, England

First name(s) Last name(s) DOB Occupation
Helen (Louise) Hipgrave (Garner) 30 Oct 1926 At School
Sex Female Marital status Single

Schedule 103 Schedule Sub Number 3


If you look on the actual image of the Register, you can see that Hipgrave has been added in green ink above her maiden name of Garner, and that there is a notation in the address column indicating when the change was made by a series of letters of numbers.

Incidentally she is occupant #3 at that address ... the other 2 names are still closed.

In fact, most of the records on that whole page are closed, with just 4 open to view.

That means that no updates have been done because the proof was not available.

FMP is trying to update as fast as they can, using freebmd, GRO records, and death certificates sent in by users as proof that someone has indeed died.

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D7006268

ADM 188/963/48434
Name Bickley, Joseph Andrew Charles
Official Number: K48434
Place of Birth: Limehouse, London
Date of Birth: 17 January 1900

(above if relating in somewhere!)

Chris :)

A correction to Lynn's post :-

In 1931 Maud was registered at 47 Rushmore Road, Hackney as Bickley (living with Joseph -not Fred):

1931
47 Rushmore Road, Hackney
Joseph Bickley
Maud Bickley
Ada Ethel Hurne
Arthur Charles Hurne
Ethel Amy Alice Hurne
Dorothy Norman
Henry Norman
-----------------------------------------------
?
1935
34 Essex Street
Joseph Bickley
Maud Bickley
Laban John Green
William Jnr. Thorpe
Ellen Thorpe
Mary Thorpe
William Thorpe
---------------------------------------------
?
1939
34 Shenfield Street
Joseph Bickley
Maud Bickley
Laban John Green
Mary Thorpe
William Thorpe

If you have Fred and Maud together after 1931, this would imply that Maud is not the same person.

What address is on Joseph's birth certificate (1931)?

Feel free to correct me but it seems as though Fred & Maud separated but most likely couldn't afford a divorce so went their own ways

Fred was only free to marry Emma after the death of his wife in 1942 (see Mary's post above)

That seems most likely but Lynn has these as Fred Garner and Maud Baitrum:

1933 Electoral Register
36 Sussex Road, Harrow
Frederick Charles Garner
Maud Garner

But these can't be the correct couple if Maud was already living with Joseph Bickley.

Could this be Fred Garner with his parents in 1930?:

1930 Electoral register
10 Orchard Road, Brentford & Chiswick
Charles Garner
Ellen Garner
Frederick Garner
Louisa Hillier

Which means that this isn't Fred Garner with Maud Baitrum

1930 Electoral Register
36 Sussex Road, Harrow
Frederick Charles Garner
Maud Garner

AustinQ

Yes it looks like them in 1930

See page 1 2 Apr 2016 17:52

Guessing Louisa has been spelt wrongly on one of the entries!

.
1936 34 Essex Street Maud and Joseph
1936 29,Essex Street is Benjamin Bickley

1939 34,Shenfield Street Maud and Joseph Bickley.
1939 29,Shenfield Street is Benjamin Bickley.

Maryb.