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I think I need a fresh pair of eyes on this so hopefully someone can help. I have been trying now for over 11 months to try and track my Ggrandfather’s parents etc. He was JOHN HENRY LLOYD born Bloxwich, Staffordshire in December 1864. His father’s name was WILLIAM (from marriage and birth certificate) and I believe I have the right Mother, SARAH SOMERFIELD. Also from the birth certificate. I also believe that Sarah died in 1871/72 I cannot find him or them in 1871 or 1881. Well not conclusively. There is a John in 1881 with a William and a Martha but this is not them. I really would like more info on William I have his marriage in 1888 and on all census after 1891. Any help appreciated

John - whose MC & BC have you got - John's?? I'm just having trouble with why you only think his mother was Sarah Somerfield.

I have John's marriage and birth cert. I believe it is the correct birth cert but there are 3 John's born around this time. The reason I think it is correct is that the name SOMMERFIELD (Sarah's maiden name) crops up in a couple of descendants second christian names. My mother said they often wondered where the name had come from?

John There is a Sarah Lloyd who died in 1872 reference Jan-Mar 1872 aged 21 Wolverhampton 6B 347 Is this of any help??? Victor

Got you. OK - William - have you any idea of his age or place of birth, have you found him on any census??

It could possibly be her but there are a lot of possible Sarah's deaths around this time. that particular one would have been 14? whan she had John. Possible but tenuous Cheers

That's the problem Jools. I have no idea of his age or place of birth. All I know was he was a miner. I can understand the family missing one census but 2?

Have you seen this family in 1871?? Living 46 New St, Walsall foreign Ann M Somerfield 4 Bloxwich, Staffordshire, England Daughter Walsall Staffordshire John Somerfield 7 Bloxwich, Staffordshire, England Son Walsall Staffordshire Sarah Somerfield 29 Bloxwich, Staffordshire, England Daughter Walsall Staffordshire Willm Somerfield 70 Bloxwich, Staffordshire, England Head Walsall Staffordshire Sack maker Sampson Young 20 Bloxwich, Staffordshire, England Boarder Walsall Staffordshire Source information: RG10/2958 Registration district: Walsall Sub-registration district: Bloxwich ED, institution, or vessel: 8 Folio: 82 Page: 25 The enumerator was not having a good day when he wrote out this page. William 70 is down as married, so too is everyone else in the family!!

John Have you searched for the marriage of Willam and Sarah? If so where have you searched, so we don't go over the same ground. Victor

I have seen those Sommerfields and on the IGI there are some possibilities but nothing connecting William. Re the marriage I have searched the GRO The problem also here is how old were they? could have married before 1837 but unlikely

What was Williams profession on Johns marriage certificate?

Thanks for looking Georgina but I put in the main message that this was not them. I thought at first it was but after a long discussion on here with another member it i not. She can claim Martha and her family and in 1891 you will see that John living next door to them. That John also states Willenhall as birth place. Close to Bloxwich I know but it is definetly not them

William was a coal miner

John This realy is a good one. I too have mebers of my tree that have been vacant from two or more census and it makes it so difficult to get a good trace. Not knowing if there are other siblings around does not help the matter as far as the marriage is concerned. As you say they could have married at any time. Have you trawled 1837? I know this would be a costly afair, and that you have searche the GRO but may be the only way. Do you think they married in the same area? My wife also has a John Lloyd in her tree but there is nothing in yours as yet that seems to connect them. She is a Willenhall lass. Cheers Victor.

Victor I do have a possible sibling. I didn't want to make my message too long and turn people off. She is Ann Maria 1866 but I think she may have died prior to 1871. Is your wife Mumzieuk?

John Sorry don't understand Victor

I have spoken to a lady on here who has a John in her tree and her nickname is Mumzieuk on har provider

No John not the same person. With maiden name is Ordidge quite uncommon and not too difficult to trace in and around Willenhall, its where they came from to get Willenhall that is the problem. But thats another story. Cheers Vicotr

hi,john, what about the other Willenhall, a little out i know but just east side of coventry??? kay.