Genealogy Chat

My guess is that, whoever Florence was, she was sent away to Plymouth to have the baby. Nichola said that Mary Jane Warren who brought up the child was her great grandmother.

I take it that Florence Maud Bond gave birth to Florence Beatrice Bond in 1907. Although the 1911 census where the child is with the Warren family has down as Beatrice.

Nichola can you also tell us what relation the two Florences's are to you.

Wendy

Nicola, please could you answer the question that has been asked 3 times now.

What exactly was the mothers name on the 1907 birth certificate. Was it Florence, Florence Maud or Florence Beatrice.

photographers assistants were probably more common than you think. I have one in my tree from the 1910s. She also had an illegitimate child a long way from where she was born and bred, in Lancashire when she was born in Kent. There also appear to be many Florence Bonds. Possible but maybe not probable unless it was a family name and a family business.

The point I was trying to make was that she may have been a photographer's assistant in 1907 but not necessarily in 1901 or 1911.

Did Florence ever marry? You say she was still connected to the family when she died in the 1990's - was that as Bond?

These are the only likely births for a Florence B. Bond that I can see who would be old enough to have a baby in 1907:-


Name: BOND, Florence Beatrice
Registration district: Wisbech
County: Cambridgeshire
Year of registration: 1874
Quarter of registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
Mother's maiden name: Not available before 1911 Q3
Volume no: 3B
Page no: 594

or:-

Name: BOND, Florence Beatrice
Registration district: Bedminster
County: Somerset
Year of registration: 1889
Quarter of registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
Mother's maiden name: Not available before 1911 Q3
Volume no: 5C
Page no: 666

Kath. x

Does the birth certificate of the 1907 Florence give her mother's name as Florence Beatrice or just Florence?

Kath. x

I agree the scenario is possible. The trouble is just how few photographer's assistants there were in this era . Are we really going to get two called Florence Bond?

Nicola

I can't really see that Florence Maud Hudson is your Flo

Would she really have got married in 1903, had a child with her husband in 1904, one under her maiden name in 1907, then went back to her husband and stayed with him until her death in 1946 (it is the right death as probate was given to her husband William Robert Hudson). Very forgiving Victorian man!

Also she seems to describe herself as Florence Maud in the census but only as Florence on the birth certificate.

There are so many Florence Bond's and as you do not know her age or where she was actually born she could have been eg ag13 and a scholar in 1901, started work as a photographer's assistant, had a child when age 19, then changed her job. In that day and age she could have been sacked from her job and taken up something new or even emigrated.

Just putting this as a possible scenario to show that it is possible you will never find out who exactly she was.

I know people (in books anyway!) did 'borrow' people's names but was it really commonplace?

Just a query - in your opening post you said that it was a Florence Beatrice Bond who had a child in 1907. Was this a typing error?

I guess I will never know whether the Florence Bond registering the child in 1907 was Florence Hudson (nee Bond) or someone who knew her and borrowed her identity. It is a very strange thing that someone said they were Florence Bond - photographer's assistant if they wanted to lie but get in and out of the registrar's office without being asked for some id.
I look at the 1911 census for her as Florence Hudson and ponder whether this was a marriage or two people living togeher as the done thing - I mean by that they have the one child - Geoffrey - early in the marriage and no other child. Was it a case of being unlucky or of living a strange married life?

Florence's death:

Deaths Mar 1946
Hudson Florence M 71 Norwich 4b 256

Rose

Her parents marriage, her father was a policeman

Name: Phoebe Doughty
Spouse Name: William Samuel Clements Bond
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 26 Feb 1870
Parish: Islington St Mary
Borough: Islington
Father Name: Thomas Doughty
Spouse Father Name: Jonathan Bond
Register Type: Parish Register

*********Note**********

The original of the 1911 only has Florence, William and their son on it. The Woods family must have a different address.

The following fits in with the above christening, found by brummiejan, of Florence Maud Bond in 1876. The 1901 has her as photographers assistant to father William.


William Bond
Biographical details: Bond was a professional studio photographer at various locations around Norfolk operating in Cawston, New Catton, Aylsham and at least eight different places in Norwich between 1875 and 1916. A carte de visite naming his studios at Bank Plain and New Catton advertises ‘Photos taken by electric light’ and ‘Schools, wedding parties and every class of outdoor work attended to’.
Extent and nature of the collection: Ten images by William Bond appear on Picture Norfolk, mainly portraits of soldiers but also some of Norwich Castle and one of an 1895 landau made by George Morris and Company.
Location: NHC, row 46A - cabinet cards, carte de visite

just re-reading these posts

Nicola please can you clarify something for me as I am not sure I am reading this right

Is the child you know of born in Plymouth in 1907 Florence Beatrice Bond or was that her mother's name or was it both their names. As far as I can see we have wandered through a Florence Beatrice,a Florence & a Florence Maud

Nicola

If anyone wishes to contact you away from the board, all he/she needs to do is click on your name.

It is unnecessary for you to post your personal details on here..........

It is a very odd state of affairs.
I wonder whether someone who knew Forence Hudson (nee Bond) made use of her identity.

I am not sure it is her - getting myself in a knot here!!

Births Jun 1876 (>99%)
Bond Florence Maud Camberwell 1d 819

Marriages Sep 1903 (>99%)
BARDWELL Georgiana Rosetta Norwich 4b 216
BOND Florence Maud Norwich 4b 216
Hudson William Robert Norwich 4b 216
Ward Walter William Norwich 4b 216

BUT!

1911 England Census
Name: Florence Maud Hudson
Age in 1911: 37
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1874
Relation to Head: Wife
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Norwich, Norfolk
Civil parish: Norwich
County/Island: Norfolk
Country: England
Street Address: 29 Heigham Road, Norwich
Marital Status: Married
Years Married: 7
Estimated Marriage Year: 1904
Registration district: Norwich
Registration District Number: 225
Sub-registration district: West Wymer

William Robert Hudson 37
Florence Maud Hudson 37
Geoffrey Hudson 6
Ada Elizabeth Woods 24
Clarence Victor Woods 20
Theodore Mendelssohn Woods 17
Alexander Frederick Woods 14
George Woods 10
Ronald Burton Woods 6
Kate Woods 2

On balance, the Florence born Islington looks like a good bet - how many Florence Bonds photographers assistant can there have been!
Though if so Plymouth seems quite a trek for her.

Although born Islington, the family was back in Norfolk by 1877 when Ann Mary was born.

- I suspect this might be her baptsim as Ann(e) mary appears to have been baptised on the same date:

name: Florence Maud Bond
gender: Female
baptism/christening date: 09 Oct 1876
baptism/christening place: Christ Church, Catton, Norfolk, England
father's name: William Bond
mother's name: Phoebe
indexing project (batch) number: I02021-3
system origin: England-EASy
source film number: 1368229
reference number: yr 1842-1879 p 170

Jan

there is a Florence Bond, b about 1877 last British address London who departed for New York from Liverpool in 1927. Could be just a coincidence

PS TO THE ABOVE
If there is anyone researching the Norfolk Bonds and might know more about the woman I mentioned I appreciate they may not want to say anything on an open message board. I can be found in the trees as Nicola Chaffe born Plymouth 1963 or via my great gran's birth as Mary Perrow St. Just 1856.
If they want to know more about the life of the 1907 child, Florence Beatrice Bond they can also contact me.
I hate to use the expression 'baby farming' because of its darker side, but clearly my great gran dabbled in this trade. If anyone has any knowledge of what papers/journals were commonly used to advertise in I would be very interested. I am intrigued how a Norfolk based woman found my great gran.

Thank you all for your noble efforts. Yes, the 1907 birth in Plymouth of Florence Beatrice Bond is what I am on about. She was born in my great grandmother's home at Oakfield Terrace Plymouth. My great gran being the Mrs Warren of the 1911 census where Florence Bond aged 4 appears as 'visitor'. She was the longest staying visitor in history - still part of the family picture right up to her 1990s death. The other young child in the 1911 census - Albert Geary - stayed until his death at 18. Mrs Warren's family kept Florence Beatrice Bond's identity secret - even frightened to spill the beans after Mrs Warren's death in 1945
I am curious who her mother, who called herself Florence Bond "photographer's assistant" was. Since posting my request I have noticed the Islington born Florence Bond "photographer's assistant' who lived with her parents in Norwich - 1881, 1891 and 1901 census. This lady disappears - I cannot fathom where she is in the 1911 census.

Have you found the child 1911? If this is her the family might be connected (or not!)

1911 England Census
Name: Beatrice Bond
Age in 1911: 4
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1907
Relation to Head: Visitor
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Plymouth
Civil parish: Plymouth
County/Island: Devon
Country: England
Street Address: 16 St James Terrace, Plymouth
Registration district: Plymouth
Registration District Number: 276
Sub-registration district: Plymouth South West

Mary Jane Warren 58
Eleanor Mary Hackward 28
Winnie May Warren 17
Gertrude Warren 13
Albert Edward Geary 5
Beatrice Bond 4
Olive Knight 18

Seems like a good candidate for her child?

Births Mar 1907 (>99%)
BOND Florence Beatrice Plymouth 5b 217