General Chat

Just seen a thing on the news that says some kind of phonics kits are being given out to teach children to read earlier at school. About eighteen years ago, I started primary school and could read and write. I had been starved of oxygen at birth and it was doubtful, in the doctor's opinion that I would be able to do such tasks as reading, writing etc. So my mum taught me to read and write when I was about three, in fact I think I could probably read before then. When I got to primary school, my teacher told my mum off for teaching me to read and said it would probably have stressed me - it did nothing of the sort. I wonder what has changed in the last few years.

all they are doing is going back to how children had been taught to read for yrs.they have been experimenting on children for yrs and now find they have it wrong. also they said that schools are not going to be forced to implement this,

My daughter went to school in the early 70s, when the barmy local authority decided that children should not be taught to read until they were 7 years old, and then by a peculiar method with a special alphabet and special words (can't remember the name). As my daughter had been able to read and write since age 4, this caused her quite a few problems and I got the Bad Mother badge for having 'forced' her to read and write - and the wrong way, too, apparently. OC

Is it progress I wonder - what was wrong with learning the old fashioned way - a is for apple b is for bee etc- etc- etc- Love Mary xx

My two children were able to read and write, before they went to school, at around 5 years of age. They were pretty good at numeracy also...... as has been said............'' black marks for teaching them too early''!! Bob

OC...was your daughter taught to read with ITA?...can't remember what it stands for. It was a very peculiar method looking back with its own strange symbols/letters..Don't know if it helped me or hindered but I have always been able to read and write quite well. I think schools keep trying different methods don't they? My children are being taught with the Ruth Miskin literacy programme and seem to be doing alright out of it.I suppose time will tell whether it catches on in most schools or if it gets abandoned and forgotten in the future. Sandra. xxx

I teach pre-school kids and i find each child has different skills, we have had the odd mum come in and say I want my child to start reading.....ermm not that simple, they have to learn how books work first! I did loads at home with my eldest and he enjoyed it but he struggled at school..... he is now finishing his degree at Uni. My youngest wasn't interested, he is still at school but they've now told me he's gifted! Don't ask me where they get it lol Kids learn at their own pace...with the right encouragement of course Susie x

Susie, I agree! All children are different, whatever works for one might not for another. I too work with pre-school/reception age children. Learning a love of books is most important first. There is no surer way to turn a child against something than to force them. Those of us who could read before we started school learnt because we wanted to, not because our parents wanted us to. (Well, hopefully most of us!) Dawn

You know, OC, that's not far off what happened with me and my mum. Not only did Mum get told off for teaching me to read, she was told off for teaching me 'Ay, bee, cee' instead of teaching me the alphabet phonetically. Not long ago, I did extra-curricular volunteering at a local primary school on my afternoon off college. I listened to some of the children reading and saw that they were taught to read in a way where they spell out the word gradually out loud and then work out how to say the word. It seemed very strange to me.

My daughter began school in 1962 and was taught the 'alphabet' way. Moved home and in Wiltshire in 1965 son began school and was taught phonetic way - played havoc with him - he is a reader but to date he is not sure of alphabet. At the same time I complained to teacher when I saw daughter's class work and her spelling in school - 'oh we want them to express themselves first then we shall correct their spelling'. We moved to N. Ireland in 1967 and returned to traditional methods but this experimental period caused nothing but problems for quite some time.

Another thing schools use to do...... When I was at infant school...many moons ago lol I was left handed, they made me write with my right hand! When I went to my next primary school age 6 I did everything backwards including reading from right to left, the headmisstress at the previous school had told my mum I was top of the class lol I hate to see what the bottom was! Now I'm ambidextrous but predominantely right handed Still think I might be an alien lol Susie x

Different children need different techniques. My older daughter can't see if something is wrongly spelled. She's not dyslexic but her memory is aural rather than visual. My own memory is very much a visual one and I find myself reading and not hearing the words in my head but recognising their shapes. I was a primary school teacher for several years and I've taught a lot of children to read. The school where I worked used a variety of methods. We'd start with Look and Say because we found children were able to make very quick progress with that but we'd add in phonics so if they met new words they could often work them out for themselves. There is a passage of writing which keeps going round the Internet in e-mails but I don't have a saved copy at the moment. That has gobbledegook 'words' but you can read every one because the shape of each word is right and the beginning and end is the same. It surprises people but it is because most of us actually use Look and Say rather than phonics. If something didn't work with a child we'd try anything we could think of to help them. I made loads of 'books' about tractors for one boy who was struggling and whose only interest was farm machinery!!! Sue

I was taught to read and write before I started school as well, I think most parents learn the children in different ways. I do rememer being in my primary school and going the local library and taking home 5 books which was the most you could have and Im still reading books only this time my one love History books. Perhaps if parents found out what interested the kids and tried to buy books of what they like it might help them more. Like the tractors that were mentioned. Yvonne

Yes, ITA, that was it! I never forced any of my kids to learn to read - they WANTED to. My middle girl was reading by age 2 and a half - I kept that very very quiet as I knew what people would say, but she would get a book, follow me round the house and say 'What does that word say?' I would tell her and she would remember it. And it wasn't just that she was remembering the whole of the book -she could remember the shape of the word, I think, and knew what it was in a different book. Children do different things at different speeds, but why is is so frowned upon for a parent to teach a child to read, if that child desperately WANTS to learn 'No darling, I mustn't tell you what that word says, you will have to wait till you go to school' (I also did the other stuff too, which teachers say they would rather we parents teach - doing up coats, putting on shoes, getting trousers up and down, etc, table manners and so on). OC

I see nothing wrong with reading and writing before school kate , either, some children want to others dont, mine were all different, Caz xxx

My eldest could read before she went to school, but it was purely accidental! From an early age, we played sound games on the bus or while out walking, purely to stop her getting bored, like I'I Spy' or 'What sound does grass begin with, what sound does it end with, what is the middle sound etc' I always read to her, and she started looking at the words, especially a nursery rhyme book. She knew the words to the Nursery Rhymes and started following them with her finger. She started school a term early, (she begged the head to let her!) and I don't think she was ever made to read the reading scheme at school! Oh - and she's dyslexic - can't spell to save her life! Played similar games with the younger, but she never physically followed the words. When she was 3, she got a book, sat on my lap and said 'Teach me to read'!!! As she had no intention of following the words, I said I couldn't. By half term of her new school, she was on free reading - obviously had been teaching herself secretly!! Played similar games with my grand daughter. She was 4 when she started in reception. Last September. She turned 5 at Easter (still in reception) and is now reading class 2 books! None of these children was 'forced' to learn, in fact I refused to 'teach' my youngest, but they had a love of books and a knowledge of letter sounds, which is all thats needed. maggie

We learned by phonetics in the 1950's so whats new. I could read when I went to school in 1955 at 4 1/2 , my two sons could read when they went to school as well. We were told by one teacher that No 1 son (now 30) was too advanced as he was reading Roal Dhal books when he was eight and as they were meant for eleven year olds they might upset him because they were too dark.....! What complete drivel. A lot of learning at the early stages is done at home. Children whose parents read them bed time stories then go on to look at picture books with simple words soon start to read without thinking and this puts them well ahead when they go to school. We also encouraged our's to read the news paper, something we also did at school also when in the last year at junior school (year 7?..!?) we had to write a little piece each month about topical news items.

That reminds me of something my parents told me I did, Peter. Apparently - I don't remember it myself - I could read words from a newspaper when I was two or three. I'm sure I didn't understand them but I could read them. And like you say, my parents took the time to read me stories at night. I should say, both of them read me stories at bed time, but my dad - having just got in from work - used to compromise and read the last few pages, whereas my mum would read the whole story and do voices etc. Referring to what Maggie said, I was never forced to read. I just enjoyed it. Briefly at the start of this year at university I even considered not getting a TV license, not taking my TV and just watching DVDs through my computer but I did take the TV instead. I will read anything going, in fact I was at the Spar near where I live waiting for the shop assistant to see I was at the till and ended up casually reading some memo from Head Office telling them their customer service was dreadful! I do know people who can't comprehend that you can read for pleasure. My mum is always telling me off for reading in the dark (I do it without realising).

I'm sure primary teachers would think that anything that encourages children to read is a good thing. Children do learn at different rates......my older daughter didn't read as such before going to school but she'd done all the prereading activities I could think of. The younger one was writing her name on her playgroup pictures and we realised she was remembering the shapes from the magnetic letters we'd got on the fridge at home. So I taught her to read and write at 3 because she was ready. I do remember the reception teacher at the school where I taught muttering in the staff room about parents who thought they were helping by getting the kids to write all in capital letters or teaching children to count without realising what the numbers meant. That didn't help. What bothered me about when my very imaginative older daughter started school was the way she was suddenly made to conform. Before school she was drawing amazing pictures....my favourite is still 'Hairy Leg in a Stripey Sock' but 'Square Rabbit' comes a close second! (Yes they are carefully saved!). But within a few weeks of starting school my 4 year old was drawing very traditional houses. Fortunately at 23 she is still zany. Sue

Susan, what you said about your daughter is spooky. I'm nearly twenty three so I might have been a school year younger than her but had a similar experience. When I was at primary school, my favourite colours were pale pink and sky blue - I drew everything in those colours but eventually remember being pressed by the teachers to branch out into other colours. I had watched my grandad drawing before I went to school and he used to make little circular motions with the crayon as he coloured to give an even texture - my teacher also insisted I colour from side to side, in lines. (The problem with this is that over a large surface, you can see if the artist has changed direction with the crayon.) I liked what you said about the rabbit drawing - when I was still at nursery school - I vaguely recall the picture being dated 1987 or 1988 so I was 3 or 4 - my teacher called my mum in to look at my drawing of Mum's car. No ordinary drawing, though. I had done basically an aerial view from my four year old perspective of her car! She kept it on the inside of the spice cupboard for years - probably disintegrated. Problem is, and I've found this with the three successive art courses I've done is that every time I start one, the teacher says, 'Forget what you've learnt already, start with a fresh mind, think outside the box etc' - so how are you meant to develop a personal style like that?